When should clubs have dress codes, and what is the right level?
A reader sent this article:
- King scraps all-white tennis dress code at Buckingham Palace court <https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/king-scraps-all-white-tennis-dress-code-at-buckingham-palace-court-vg0fmrnx7>
An excerpt:
On Wimbledon’s hallowed grass courts, the “almost entirely white” dress code remains as rigid as ever — but... Charles has recently relaxed the previously strict dress code [at Buckingham Palace court], with tennis whites now “preferred” but “not essential” for players, who include members of the royal family, royal household staff and their guests...
Despite being known for his smart and formal approach to dressing, it is understood the King — who is rarely seen without a tie, and never in trainers or jeans — wanted his staff and their guests to feel less restricted by protocol when playing tennis.
As old fashioned some people feel they can go anywhere and wear anything. The club should set limits to what is acceptable to their standards. People should be presentable to the establishment they are entering. The level should be set by the establishment and the patrons should abide by it. Unfortunately this is needed today more than ever.
ReplyDeleteI have always worn whites (with modest logos if visible at all) for tennis and squash. I think that is appropriate for private venues and not a hardship. I don't remember anyone complaining about wearing whites whether at homes or clubs. I am sure that in many places it was simply a custom and not a "rule," but, of course, perhaps it didn't need to be a rule for people to follow. To this day, I have seen little, if any, colorful attire that looks as good as whites on a court.
ReplyDeleteAgree
DeleteClubs should make their own rules. I wish more establishments of all kinds had dress codes. People today are pigs with no sense of occasion, no dignity, and no respect for others. I would like to go somewhere where I do not have to look at bloated, sagging flesh poorly and inadequately clad.
ReplyDeleteWell said. It seems half the people who fly domestic are dressed like they were slaughtering a pig, looked up and said “the heck with this. I’m going to Los Angeles.” They then went directly to the airport.
DeleteIsn’t that the truth. Alas, even international flights, in summer anyway, attract a few who seem to seek comfort in sloppiness.
Delete...as my Polish mother would say, "It all depends upon who they are, and from whence they came..." (in Polish, of course...). Rules aside, there's the question of good taste - - which hopefully isn't limited to one's taste buds...
DeleteBanacek
I believe that in the age of tattoos, dress codes are more critical than ever. They are being relaxed everywhere and it is a case of the pendulum swinging in the wrong direction. It is like a much worse version of the Rodney Dangerfield character in “Caddyshack”. You may have laughed at the time, but now look where it’s led.
ReplyDeleteCricket whites are now for the county championship. Red ball cricket as opposed to the limited over, white ball cricket that is so heavily promoted nowadays.
ReplyDeleteSurrey seem to be the only county that are doing anything about the decline in the traditional formats.
I once heard that the definition of a lady or gentleman is someone who always tries to make sure the people around him or her are as comfortable as possible. I think that a clearly communicated dress code is decidedly polite. If everyone is dressed to the same standard (and that standard is made clear), then there's no risk of someone being under or over-dressed and people can feel comfortable and relaxed.
ReplyDeleteYes.
DeleteI can't say. I would never wish to belong to a Club that would have me as a member.
ReplyDelete...said Samuel Clemens...
DeleteB.
Groucho was the one who said that, wasn’t he?
DeleteGroucho Marx was Samuel Clemens' nom-de-plume. By the way, when someone uses a fictitional name to write a cooking book, it is called a nom-nom-nom-de-plume
DeleteOur favorite Long Island golf club has a somewhat strict dress code. Among the forbidden garments, both on the course and in the clubhouse, are; jeans, cargo shorts, shirts without collars, and tennis clothing. My favorite directive is, “all ball caps must be worn with the brim facing forward at all times.”
ReplyDelete`I always ask "Are you a baseball catcher or a welder " ? I know a lot of welders.
DeleteBackwards ballcap makes it easier to chug a can of Natural Light (aka Fratty Light), brah!
DeleteI'm old school. A gentleman removes his hat when entering a building.
DeleteA club or establishment have the right to refuse entry on any grounds, be it dress code or not otherwise the freedom of association is being violated
ReplyDeleteClass will out!
ReplyDeleteIt is not as easy for clubs to enforce dress codes as it once was. Sadly, younger generations scoff at what they deem stuffy rules of what is and is not appropriate. It is easy to forget that most clubs must have an eye to the present and future , in order to survive economically. They are increasingly reliant on younger members dues, and thus must cater to changing tastes.
ReplyDeleteThis phenomenon is on display currently at the Yale Club, where they have placed a sign at the entrance to the main lounge reminding members of their dress code. However upon entering the beautiful space there is a stark dichotomy of younger people in white sneakers and older people in leather dress shoes.
The same was true at the Princeton
DeleteClub before thier closure during covid. I was
OK with it but not my wife.
The vast majority of clubs require players to wear clothes and shoes made for tennis. Shirtless is of course banned. Often, the clubs also disallow tanks or sleeveless shirts, tees for other sports teams, backwards ball caps, and bare midriffs. However, an all-white rule is uncommon outside of clubs in the Northeast. Either all-white or with color, no one should get their knickers in a twist about it. The important traditions -- such as honest line calls and genuine courtesy -- live on, even at municipal courts.
ReplyDeleteYour serve is perfect. Thank you. Integrity and love for the game are what matters. “It doesn’t matter what you wear just as long as you are there.”
ReplyDeleteDress codes are really essential to preserve the sense of dignity and good manners to be expected from all members therein .
ReplyDeleteWell, the point of belonging to a private club is to have a place where members can be assured of a certain kind of experience. In this sense, private clubs stand in opposition to public establishments (restaurants, bars, hotels, tennis courts, golf clubs, marinas, etc.), which are often an unpleasant and anonymous wilderness of "anything goes" vulgarity. Just last night, I had dinner at an expensive "luxury" restaurant on the water, and a man at the next table was not only dressed in flip-flops and a t-shirt but droned endlessly about how much he disliked his sister (I assume the feeling is mutual). I would much rather have had dinner at our comparatively modest yacht club where men wear jackets to dinner and the conversation is polite. Dress codes and behavior codes are, in a sense, the whole point of a private club. As for the details, I suppose that's up to each club's membership. But I think white on the tennis court and a jacket at dinner is not too much to ask.
ReplyDeleteExactly what about his dress offended you? Aren’t you really saying that the restaurant should screen out people of a certain ‘class’ so you can enjoy the Luxury experience you believe you deserve? And, isn’t a club member’s banal discourse about his golf score just as obnoxious?
DeleteI am not the original Anonymous - but i agree with those statements. I would be offended because he didnt respect the setting and his fellow diners. Has nothing to do with class - you can buy a pair of khakis and a dress shirt from Target or JC Penney - it has do do with the overall atmosphere. Used to be that even guys who worked in a factory wore a suit to church. It is just being decent.
DeleteIn your personal opinion. Certainly not everyone else’s.
DeleteI truly do not understand why anyone needs to respect me by dressing in a way that “I” find respectful. How egotistical. I’ve been dressing well my entire life and I don’t need others to respect me. We had to dress to code in boarding school as 13 year olds. We are hopefully able to live without the respect from others as adults.
DeleteApparently some readers of this blog don't mind being around slovenly, vulgar people. How lucky they are. They have all fifty states as their personal Garden of Eden. By contrast, people who do mind being around slovenly vulgar people have clubs. Happy we will all be if the two groups never intrude upon one another.
DeleteSo people who wear T-shirts and Flip Flops are slovenly and vulgar? And the “gentleman” at the luxury restaurant who treats the staff like slaves and leaves no tip is worthy of our esteem? It is 2025. We are past Western Civilization’s childish affectation with fine robes and jewels. You are, today, no better a human being than an impoverished basket weaver in Southern Sudan. And, anyway, what would Jesus say about your attitude toward others?
DeleteI don't know any impoverished basket weavers in Southern Sudan, but I'm guessing that they make an effort to looked well-groomed and put together when they appear in public.
DeleteYes they do. No matter how poor people are they want to look “put together.” I’ve seen this in poorest parts of Ethiopia and the Democratic Republic of the Congo, among other places. You can spot à street person in Addis Ababa immediately. They look just like a street person in New York City.
DeleteSorry. Still don’t get it. How did the man’s dress show lack of respect? Respect for what? Your self-indulgent believe that diners who can afford luxury dining should dress the way you think they should? Again, why do flip - flops offend you so much?
ReplyDeleteSave for the beach or poolside, you’ll never see me wearing flip flops in a public place. My personal wardrobe follows the dictum, “every girl’s crazy about a sharp dressed man.”
DeleteAgreed, as long as she is over the age of 70. Wake up everybody! Your attire, car, house and degrees don’t matter anymore. At all. That party ended about 25 years ago.
DeleteYou think so? It seems to me the whole social environment is fed by “look at me” social media. All attention is focused on what one is (or is not) wearing, be it clothes or jewelry.
DeleteIf a dinner guest doesn't mind when a man at the next table deliberately and voluntarily displays his naked feet and toenails in a fine dining establishment and then goes on to complain loudly and narcissistically about how everyone has done him wrong, then I don't know what to say. You can't argue about taste, I guess. The man in question either doesn't know or doesn't care about how his self-presentation and words affect other people. If that's not offensive, what is?
DeleteDear Anon: July 18, 9:10AM.
DeleteBreaking news for Western Civilization! “Your attire, car, house and degrees don’t matter anymore.”
For those of us who still live on Planet Earth this revelation is somewhat puzzling – akin to Moses coming down from the mountain with the stone tablets.
Anyway, now I guess what really matters is how clean your flip-flops are before you shamble into that swank restaurant.
I don’t wear flip flops. Most often I wear Alden tassel loafers. Generally worn with a pair of khakis or a pair of tan cords in colder weather. I No longer wear suits very often. Generally a blazer or tweed with a tie for some occasions.
DeleteBut, the idea of dressing out of respect for or from others or the idea that I care what others think about what others think of my clothes to me is absolutely ridiculous. I dress the way I dress because it feels nice. It makes me feel like my father and my grandfather. I find it very sad judging others on how they dress. Seems very weak -To each his own.
Seems like you dress out of respect for your father and grandfather.
DeleteYes, maybe someone should get a pair of John Lobb Flip-flops for Christmas?
DeleteThat me be clear. I don’t dress out of respect for anyone, including my father and grandfather. You can twist it anyway you would like. Anyway, that that makes you feel comfortable
DeleteWho is John Lob ?
DeleteJohn Lobb London - shoes for movie stars and aristocrats $$$$$$$$.
Deletehttps://www.johnlobb.com/en_us/
Which one are you, a movie star or an aristocrat?
DeleteThere often is a strong conceit to dressing down. “Look at me I don’t have to wear a tie.”
ReplyDeleteIf you have the option do not dress as if you can do whatever you please. Dress as if you care about how others look upon you. Do not let your dress demonstrate disdain for others, as well as yourself.
ReplyDelete“Dress as if you care about how others look upon you”? What? Why?
Delete“ Dress as if you care about how others look upon you”. Ok. So when I visit Mongolia next month how should I dress? Like a Mongolian? Or like a Yale-educated White male imperialist? I want to get this right. It will be the first time I will dress because I took your advice.
ReplyDeleteSuggest you don’t dress like a Mongolian. You won’t fit in. Dress as who you are and in the fashion your hosts expect you to dress.This will make both parties comfortable from the outset. First impressions, as you know, are very important. Both you and the Mongolians might feel a bit uncomfortable if you show up in a tank top and flip flops. The Mongolians will likely be dressed in their best everyday business clothes to fit the occasion of meeting à well off Westerner. If you travel among the poorest of the poor please be careful about making judgements about clothing. The clothes worn by the absolute poorest may be the only set of clothes they have.
DeleteDear Anon 7:18. Sage Advice. Do you write from experience? Mic Drop.
DeleteWhere is the fun in going to a nice restaurant and dressing as if you were going to a seaside fish shack? I think you should dress to honor the occasion. I think it would be silly to wear a suit and tie to a seaside fish shack.
ReplyDeleteDoes what you wear enhance the taste of the food or, instead, enhance your opinion of yourself?
DeleteIt enhances my opinion of myself. Have to do something when living in a judgmental society.
DeleteMuffmeister, this post has gone sideways and exposed the shamelesss snobbery that affects so many in our society. Snobbery is the antithesis of Prep. True Prep could care less about what another human being is wearing or saying. To care about these things requires far too great an effort for a True Prep. What is very evident here is that our upper middle class is terrified of losing the trappings of their so-called success. Their clubs, their attire, the THINGS which they believe cause them to be superior. No less a light than George B. Shaw thought on this 100 years ago and quipped ‘ Only where there is pecuniary equality can the distinction of merit stand out’. Sounds about right. Yours, Ferd without his laptop
ReplyDeleteI have tried several times rather awkwardly to say the same thing. But the posts were never posted. Thank you for saying it so succinctly.
Delete"True Prep could care less about what another human being is wearing or saying" is one of the most backward things I have ever read. If it were true, then True Prep would not have founded prep schools and yacht/golf/social clubs where they can be surrounded only (or primarily) by people who dress and speak well. When was the last time you saw True Prep voluntarily spending time with people who lack taste, refinement, and style? Things don't make people superior. But perceptive, educated, and sensitive people prefer to be around superior things.
DeleteDear anon 10:14 Whilst it may be True that True Prep started a handful of yacht clubs and golf clubs in the 1800’s, that ended generations ago. Today’s “preppy clubs” are bastions of vulgarity, the very embodiment of nouveau riche. True Prep would not be caught dead at one of these places now anymore than she would shop at a Mall. As for voluntarily placing oneself among people who lack taste, refinement and style, True Prep does this all the time. For example I visit this Blog. Is that not proof enough?
DeleteIf True Prep does, as you say, voluntarily place itself among people who lack taste, refinement, and style, then why would True Prep avoid (and "not be caught dead at") private clubs that are, supposedly, "bastions of vulgarity"? Those clubs sounds like just the kind of place True Prep would love. In any case, it's simply dishonest (or grossly misinformed) to say that traditional East Coast clubs are bastions of vulgarity. In my experience, the yacht, golf, tennis, and social clubs of Mufflandia are filled to rafters with people who are well-turned-out, charming, worldly, kind, and interesting. There are exceptions, of course. But they are exceptions that prove the rule.
DeleteLacking knowledge of the details, I am unable to comment on the situation at the Buckingham Palace Courts. But I love that this post has been the occasion for such a lively discussion of clothes, manners, history, culture, and civilization itself!
DeleteI don't have a strong opinion about the details of people's dress, but I will plant my flag and ask others to rally round if they are so moved. I believe that one essential element (maybe THE essential element) of TTBP is that we strive to do everything with a gesture of respect and courtesy towards others. We offer genuine compliments freely. We smile often. We are humble in victory and gracious in defeat. We are quick with a note of condolence or congratulations. We are forgiving, modest, observant, patient, and supportive--not out of weakness but because we know our own worth and thus have no desire to criticize others or bring them down. We give the same respect to the company president and the newest intern. We seek to move through the world with calmness, courtesy, good humor, and good will.
If these things are true of the ethos of TTBP, then I venture to say that we can't leave clothes out of it. We cannot say that we "dress only for ourselves" any more than we can say that we drive only for ourselves, or speak only for ourselves. Everything we say and do (including how we dress) should show respect and courtesy toward the people with whom we share our communities.
Granted, the details become a matter of some subtlety, because different communities have different standards and traditions. However, we can all identify who has and who has not put thought and effort into dressing in a way that others will find pleasant, or at least not offensive. And I venture to say that we should dress to be pleasant just as we speak to be pleasant.
Speaking of Buckingham Palace, I hear the Royal Family is now very much into wearing flip-flops around there. King Charles, in particular, is a big fan of his (bespoke) rubber flip-flops, and is planning to wear them during his many ceremonial duties, and diplomatic trips abroad. He feels this will give him a "common touch" whilst among his subjects.
DeleteI couldn't have written it any better myself!
ReplyDelete